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Amazon invests in Luma


awraynor

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itGeeks

I also think there will be an about face in this unless Luma is able to come up with something very clever to deal with double NAT. The reason being that there are certain setups out there that simply won't allow the ISP router to be replaced. In those cases, Luma will have to sit behind another router and let it handle DHCP duties. A DMZ would probably solve this but I believe they've taken a stance on that. Unless they provide some sort of solution to these types of scenarios, they'll have some pretty upset customers on their hands, especially with the limited 15-day return window.

Agreed, I have such a service it FiOs, If you only have internet service with them then its no problem to remove there router but if you also have there TV and or phone service there router needs to be first inline with everything else behind it. I hang my Untangle router off a DMZ on the FiOs router and everything is happy. I even tried doing things the other way around and hanging the FiOs router off a DMZ from my router but that caused problems with guide data and On-Demand.

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Funny that no one wrote a story when I invested in Luma. 

On one hand they are well funded, on the other hand big investor's can hinder the development of a tech start-up. One concern I have with any company like Luma is, how do you get your target market t

Hey guys...first time poster here. I stumbled upon the forum while doing some research on Luma. I also pre-ordered a 3-pack after I saw that Amazon is a backer. I currently run a Sophos UTM and 2x R7

itGeeks

My router is physically located in my basement, with my modem, which is where the cable feed runs into the house.  I'm considering 2 3-packs of Lumas.  1 to go in the basement (if I have to have it function as my router), 2 on the main floor, 1 upstairs (possibly 2 since I'll have an extra), then I have a garage being fed with a cat6 line about 80 feet behind the house that would get 1 Luma.  Everything would be fed with a cat6 since the house already has wire running to every room.

 

My primary purpose for wanting this is the mesh wireless with the intelligent auto switching and one single SSID.  Right now I have a couple AP's (just cheap routers in AP mode) with different SSID's and it's a pain.

 

I did consider running two long cords as you suggest but all the current cat6 is in the walls and I don't want to open anything up again.

 

I was under the assumption that all bandwidth going to the switch was shared/split between the devices plugged into the switch?

 

On my router I have one out to my main comp, one out to my ps4, and one out to my server (the things I didn't want sharing bandwidth with everything else on the switch), then everything else is sharing the switch.  This is incorrect?

 

I imagine even if everything was plugged into the switch the difference (if any) might be imperceptible.

 

I looked at open-mesh but 3 of the mr1750's (first floor, second floor, garage) is already more than what 6 Luma's would cost (at least if I pre-order).

 

If you're confident a Luma could handle feeding a 24 port switch maybe I have to reconsider.  I would have already bought Eero's if they were a $299 price point for a 3 pack.

You can not plug more then 1 Luma into your wired network because that will create multiple networks, As schoondog said there is no (Ethernet Backhaul) right not but they say it will come in future updates. As its been said Luma is NOT a WAP only solution, This is an all-in-one system that is designed to work together as a router and "wireless mesh" not wired solution. For your needs as you explain it then either Eero or Open-Mesh is a better fit, Both Eero and Open-Mesh support "Ethernet Backhaul" as well as wireless meshing, With Eero the wireless meshing is not enabled yet the last time I heard but it will be at some point. For WAPs only solution my vote goes to Open-Mesh, Its a hard solution to beat. 

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JROrtiz

Agreed, I have such a service it FiOs, If you only have internet service with them then its no problem to remove there router but if you also have there TV and or phone service there router needs to be first inline with everything else behind it. I hang my Untangle router off a DMZ on the FiOs router and everything is happy. I even tried doing things the other way around and hanging the FiOs router off a DMZ from my router but that caused problems with guide data and On-Demand.

Strange, I have the FiOS sitting on a DMZ from my Nighthawk and I have no problems with guide data or OD that way.

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JROrtiz

It's important to keep in mind that Luma has yet to be released. Although everything that has been discussed so far is accurate based on what we know, a lot can change. I'd just be cautious about talking about features (or lack thereof) with such finality on a product that isn't available yet.

 

My suggestion to anyone who is remotely interested in this product is to go ahead and preorder to lock in the low price. You can always return your unit(s) for a refund (keep in mind the shortened 15-day window), but you likely won't be able to get the preorder price once it's launched.

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schoondoggy

Kevin it would not surprise me if Luma makes a change to this either before release or after that would allow Luma to be put in "bridge mode" I just want to say I have no inside info on this, Its just a gut feeling as I am sure they now Eero can be setup in "bridge mode".

I would assume Luma in 'bridge mode' would turn off their security and parental controls, thus diminishing their differentiation/value. Other than FIOs, what ISP's require you to use their router? Xfinity had a big push to use their all in one device- modem, router, WiFi, but that was to promote their public WiFi network. Xfinity all in one devices are awful. If I were Luma, I would leverage their relationship with Amazon and bundle Luma with a modem for Xfinity or Time Warner or Cox. If that is too pushy I would set up forums to discuss removing the ISP's AIO and replacing it with a modem, as to best utilize the Luma.

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itGeeks

Strange, I have the FiOS sitting on a DMZ from my Nighthawk and I have no problems with guide data or OD that way.

Hmmm, Interesting. When I did it after about 2-3 weeks I started having trouble, Maybe I need to revisit this and try it again. Thanks for the info.

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itGeeks

I would assume Luma in 'bridge mode' would turn off their security and parental controls, thus diminishing their differentiation/value. Other than FIOs, what ISP's require you to use their router? Xfinity had a big push to use their all in one device- modem, router, WiFi, but that was to promote their public WiFi network. Xfinity all in one devices are awful. If I were Luma, I would leverage their relationship with Amazon and bundle Luma with a modem for Xfinity or Time Warner or Cox. If that is too pushy I would set up forums to discuss removing the ISP's AIO and replacing it with a modem, as to best utilize the Luma.

I don't want to sound like I am disagreeing with you but I don't think by putting Luma in "bridge mode" is going to disable all the wonderful security on Luma, It will only disable the routing functions of Luma but all the filtering & security should still work I (think) at least that's how it works when you put Untangle in "bridge mode"

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schoondoggy

I don't want to sound like I am disagreeing with you but I don't think by putting Luma in "bridge mode" is going to disable all the wonderful security on Luma, It will only disable the routing functions of Luma but all the filtering & security should still work I (think) at least that's how it works when you put Untangle in "bridge mode"

You don't have to agree with me  :) your point is well taken. The question will come down to how intertwined are the features on Luma? I still question how many ISP's require you to use their router?

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essential

Luma will not support Ethernet back haul at launch. They will use the second radio for mesh. I had the same question on a free standing garage:

http://homeservershow.com/forums/index.php?/topic/10447-luma-wifi-security-and-eero/?p=110699

Luma are not WAP, at launch there is nothing to be gained by connecting each one via wired Ethernet.

As to your bandwidth question; if you are talking about Internet bandwidth then everything plugged into any port or connected via WiFi is sharing the Internet bandwidth. How fast is your Internet connection? 

The first Luma acts as a router and a WAP. The Gigabit Ethernet connection from the first Luma to your switch carries Internet to the devices connected to the switch and carries traffic from WiFi connected devices to devices on your switch. Other Luma devices mesh/talk to each other via the second radio in each device.

In your current configuration, the devices connected to your router do not have any priority over the devices on your switch. How many devices are plugged into the 24 port switch? Other than multiple SSID are you having any other network issues?

 

Hmm, that puts a damper on my plans, Ethernet backhaul seems like it would be a foundational feature.  I suppose if it was included in their first update which was within a month of so of launch it would be fine but who knows how long it would take for them to include it.

 

I have TWC 50/5 (best they offer here) ... I meant more along the lines of bandwidth sharing on the switch itself.  I thought each wired LAN port on my router was limited to 1 Gbps.  So, for example, if I have one of my wired router LANs going to my main computer, it has full bandwidth of that output, but if one of my wired router LANs is going into my switch and there are 9 devices running on that switch, aren't they sharing the bandwidth of that one LAN port?  That's how I thought it worked, it sounds like I'm incorrect.  I suppose it doesn't really matter because I imagine it's near impossible to saturate a 1 Gbps connection anyway.

 

I believe we have 16 of the ports taken on the switch, but every room in the house is wired with 2 cat6 from the switch, there might only be 7 devices actually connected to the switch though, I'd have to go do a count to give an exact number, the rest of the wires are just running to open wall jacks.

 

You can not plug more then 1 Luma into your wired network because that will create multiple networks, As schoondog said there is no (Ethernet Backhaul) right not but they say it will come in future updates. As its been said Luma is NOT a WAP only solution, This is an all-in-one system that is designed to work together as a router and "wireless mesh" not wired solution. For your needs as you explain it then either Eero or Open-Mesh is a better fit, Both Eero and Open-Mesh support "Ethernet Backhaul" as well as wireless meshing, With Eero the wireless meshing is not enabled yet the last time I heard but it will be at some point. For WAPs only solution my vote goes to Open-Mesh, Its a hard solution to beat. 

 

Yea, I guess until they support Ethernet backhaul it won't work for me how I'd like it.  I understand how it's intended, and while most users might not have the ability to provide Etherent to each unit, those of us who do would just be strengthening the wireless network.

 

Right now I have no doubt Eero is a better solution, I was just hoping to get in on the Luma pre-order pricing.  Covering the house with Eero's or Open-Mesh AP's are going to run me more than the Luma's would have at the current price.  Also, I'm pretty sure the Eero wireless meshing is enabled, it's just their second radio for backhaul isn't enabled yet ... something along those lines, but I've read several reviews that talked about how well the mesh network worked.

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schoondoggy

Hmm, that puts a damper on my plans, Ethernet backhaul seems like it would be a foundational feature.  I suppose if it was included in their first update which was within a month of so of launch it would be fine but who knows how long it would take for them to include it.

 

I have TWC 50/5 (best they offer here) ... I meant more along the lines of bandwidth sharing on the switch itself.  I thought each wired LAN port on my router was limited to 1 Gbps.  So, for example, if I have one of my wired router LANs going to my main computer, it has full bandwidth of that output, but if one of my wired router LANs is going into my switch and there are 9 devices running on that switch, aren't they sharing the bandwidth of that one LAN port?  That's how I thought it worked, it sounds like I'm incorrect.  I suppose it doesn't really matter because I imagine it's near impossible to saturate a 1 Gbps connection anyway.

 

I believe we have 16 of the ports taken on the switch, but every room in the house is wired with 2 cat6 from the switch, there might only be 7 devices actually connected to the switch though, I'd have to go do a count to give an exact number, the rest of the wires are just running to open wall jacks.

 

 

Yea, I guess until they support Ethernet backhaul it won't work for me how I'd like it.  I understand how it's intended, and while most users might not have the ability to provide Etherent to each unit, those of us who do would just be strengthening the wireless network.

 

Right now I have no doubt Eero is a better solution, I was just hoping to get in on the Luma pre-order pricing.  Covering the house with Eero's or Open-Mesh AP's are going to run me more than the Luma's would have at the current price.  Also, I'm pretty sure the Eero wireless meshing is enabled, it's just their second radio for backhaul isn't enabled yet ... something along those lines, but I've read several reviews that talked about how well the mesh network worked.

What model is your 24 port switch?

 

A good switch should have a backplane that is non-blocking/buffering so each port is able to run at full speed. The ports in a router tend to be not as good. That is why I suggest all of your wired devices go on the same switch. The 1Gb connection from the router to the switch will be carrying internet to the wired devices and traffic from WiFi devices to any of your wired devices.

 

Ethernet back haul on WiFi is a good idea if you have heavy WiFi loads and lots of traffic to wired devices. How many wireless devices do you have and will you be streaming video from a device on your wired network? It really come down to the math, where are the heaviest loads and where are the bottlenecks? The second radio to handle back haul on the Luma should be fine for most users.

 

WIFi could be a bottleneck, the single 1Gb connection from the router to the switch could be a bottleneck, the disk drive in a server could be a bottleneck.

If you can give an idea of how many wireless devices you have and what you use them for, it would help in giving you some things to consider.

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