HSS 296 eero vs luma vs open mesh vs ubiquiti

[Dave 432]

I think we talked about them all.  Thanks to Jose Ortiz for helping out.

 

http://homeservershow.com/eero-unboxed-installed-and-discussed-on-hss-296.html

 

 

[jagowar 7]

Personally I still view the newer ubiquiti products are better.  The price comparison really doesn't matter because most will not get the cheaper early bird price.

 

Eero is $499 for a 3 router setup

Ubiquiti is $482 for 3 x AC-LR AP's and an EdgeRouter 5 port router/switch.  (current prices from amazon)

 

For that you get far more control over the system and since its all Ubiquiti the non standard poe doesn't matter.  Never saw the merit in this point imo.  Why would you ever want to use a non ubquiiti switch/router with their AP's.  I would personally always go with the same equipment manufacturer because you can really only be sure they test their products together.

[Dave 432]

That's a good comparison. Yes, you should buy the manufacturers PoE products but it still rubs people the wrong way and always will.

Here is an Amazon page full of Ubiquiti options:  http://amzn.to/1Ra4WK4

 

I gave Ubiquiti and unfair look on the last podcast since I have old hardware.  It's the 2.4Ghz kit, 3 AP's for $190. Cheap, slow, works though.  I really didn't know how bad my Ethernet was honestly.  If Ubiquiti or anyone else for that matter, wants to send over some gear I'll test it and report back.  I see the AC-LR for $108.80 so my math says your quoted setup is a little cheaper with the 5 port $60 router.  

 

The end result is that it's not apples to apples comparison.  Eero has a target market that is WAY different than Ubiquiti.  I don't doubt that Ubiquiti is better or on comparison to eero or Luma, Mesh OS, or the next one to come out.  Eero is targeting a different audience.  I can sum that audience up in one sentence.  It took me less than 5 minutes to setup 3 AP's in my house that were freaking fast.  You can dissect that sentence many ways but that is the end result their price point is targeting.

[jagowar 7]

Not disagreeing with you there but I think there are 2 markets for wifi systems.  The simple to setup like eero and the professional/enterprise systems like ubiquiti.

 

I think a very key point for that first group though is price.  Its what the google onhubs, eero and others are competing for.  To me they need to be cheaper than what you can get a traditional wifi AP for and these products are at the same price as the high end traditional AP's let alone cheaper.  IMO they will never convince people to pay for just for simplicity.  The people that will pay that kind of money are getting the enterprise grade systems that are expandable and offer more performance.  

 

Personally I went through all this just like you did and settled on the ubiquiti edge router 5 and one AC LR AP.  Total cost was about $300 and my wifi performance has been perfect since.  I also really like the idea as I need more I can add more AP's over time.  I won't need more than 2 for a while so I opted to run my router in load balancing mode (where I can have 2 internet connections and seamlessly failover between them).  That still leaves me 3 open ports for AP's.  I have opted to dedicate one of them to my media server so I only have one expansion spot but still that will be what I need for the next 5 years.

Edited February 27, 2016 by jagowar

[Dave 432]

Correct.  That is exactly what I said here:  Eero is targeting a different audience.  I can sum that audience up in one sentence.  It took me less than 5 minutes to setup 3 AP's in my house that were freaking fast.

 

I certainly don't disagree with you on price.  I would not have purchased the system at the price point they are at today.  That does leave an open door for another provider to fill however. Luma, etc. They are all testing the market right now. Simplicity, these silly smart phones, Apple, etc.  All can demand premium pricing for items that "just work."  Regardless of what we the "gurus" feel about them.  They got a million dollars in pre-orders.  Now they have good press all over the place.  They are doing something right.

 

I bought it and like it but agree with you on the Ubiquiti gear.  I look forward to testing the Luma too.  I can see someday that I will end up with Ubi or Open Mesh.  Unless Jose O. sells me a few of his units at a good price!

[itGeeks 187]

Personally I still view the newer ubiquiti products are better.  The price comparison really doesn't matter because most will not get the cheaper early bird price.

 

Eero is $499 for a 3 router setup

Ubiquiti is $482 for 3 x AC-LR AP's and an EdgeRouter 5 port router/switch.  (current prices from amazon)

 

For that you get far more control over the system and since its all Ubiquiti the non standard poe doesn't matter.  Never saw the merit in this point imo.  Why would you ever want to use a non ubquiiti switch/router with their AP's.  I would personally always go with the same equipment manufacturer because you can really only be sure they test their products together.

The point would be we consumer like options and don't like to be locked into one manufacture for everything, That would be like saying y would you want to run an Asus router with your FiOs service when Verizon provides you a router, My answer is because we can and maybe we feel company B switch/router ect. is better in our opinion right or wrong.

[itGeeks 187]

Not disagreeing with you there but I think there are 2 markets for wifi systems.  The simple to setup like eero and the professional/enterprise systems like ubiquiti.

 

I think a very key point for that first group though is price.  Its what the google onhubs, eero and others are competing for.  To me they need to be cheaper than what you can get a traditional wifi AP for and these products are at the same price as the high end traditional AP's let alone cheaper.  IMO they will never convince people to pay for just for simplicity.  The people that will pay that kind of money are getting the enterprise grade systems that are expandable and offer more performance.  

 

Personally I went through all this just like you did and settled on the ubiquiti edge router 5 and one AC LR AP.  Total cost was about $300 and my wifi performance has been perfect since.  I also really like the idea as I need more I can add more AP's over time.  I won't need more than 2 for a while so I opted to run my router in load balancing mode (where I can have 2 internet connections and seamlessly failover between them).  That still leaves me 3 open ports for AP's.  I have opted to dedicate one of them to my media server so I only have one expansion spot but still that will be what I need for the next 5 years.

Those are some very good points, I think however that I will respectfully disagree with you on paying for ease of use. Its all in marketing. Remember the average user here, Not the tech savvy group that we are. You put things like enterprise and security in the same line with ease of use for the home and that's a very powerful statement.

[schoondoggy 878]

WiFi market extremes: Home: Cheap WiFi Router or WiFi built into ISP's modem. Enterprise: Cisco or Aruba WAP's and controllers, with firewalls from Palo Alto, Cisco, CheckPoint, Juniper,

Anecdotal information: There are 11 houses on my cul-de-sac. Through neighborhood events I have gotten to know all of our neighbors. I feel comfortable in saying they all have bad WiFi coverage in their homes and they do not know there is anything better than their cheap and/or poorly placed WiFi router. Only two of these neighbors would be comfortable running Ethernet cable and placing WAP's. I am the only one in my neighborhood comfortable running a UTM or advanced firewall or router. I believe at least half of these neighbors would be interested in something like Luma or Eero, if they can deliver on their promises. I think average consumers would pay a premium for ease of setup and use, with premium security and great WiFi coverage.

[itGeeks 187]

WiFi market extremes: Home: Cheap WiFi Router or WiFi built into ISP's modem. Enterprise: Cisco or Aruba WAP's and controllers, with firewalls from Palo Alto, Cisco, CheckPoint, Juniper,

Anecdotal information: There are 11 houses on my cul-de-sac. Through neighborhood events I have gotten to know all of our neighbors. I feel comfortable in saying they all have bad WiFi coverage in their homes and they do not know there is anything better than their cheap and/or poorly placed WiFi router. Only two of these neighbors would be comfortable running Ethernet cable and placing WAP's. I am the only one in my neighborhood comfortable running a UTM or advanced firewall or router. I believe at least half of these neighbors would be interested in something like Luma or Eero, if they can deliver on their promises. I think average consumers would pay a premium for ease of setup and use, with premium security and great WiFi coverage.

Agreed & Well said.

[schoondoggy 878]

Not disagreeing with you there but I think there are 2 markets for wifi systems.  The simple to setup like eero and the professional/enterprise systems like ubiquiti.

 

I think a very key point for that first group though is price.  Its what the google onhubs, eero and others are competing for.  To me they need to be cheaper than what you can get a traditional wifi AP for and these products are at the same price as the high end traditional AP's let alone cheaper.  IMO they will never convince people to pay for just for simplicity.  The people that will pay that kind of money are getting the enterprise grade systems that are expandable and offer more performance.  

 

Personally I went through all this just like you did and settled on the ubiquiti edge router 5 and one AC LR AP.  Total cost was about $300 and my wifi performance has been perfect since.  I also really like the idea as I need more I can add more AP's over time.  I won't need more than 2 for a while so I opted to run my router in load balancing mode (where I can have 2 internet connections and seamlessly failover between them).  That still leaves me 3 open ports for AP's.  I have opted to dedicate one of them to my media server so I only have one expansion spot but still that will be what I need for the next 5 years.

As I keep posting things about Luma and Eero, I keep forgetting to comment on you post.

Buying the firewall/router and WAP's from the same company, when available, is generally a very good idea. From the sounds of your experience a full Ubiquiti system is working very well for you. Ubiquiti WAP are quite popular in the forum, but their router has had little exposure. If you have time it would be great if you could write up your system for the WiFi section under networking.